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PEsh021

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3:14 pm
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Not sure if this has already been suggested, but while a friend and I were playing the Ipad demo, one thing we noticed was the inability to plan ahead for future turns. Each turn felt more like a puzzle to find the right play but next turn was a completely different puzzle.

 

An idea that we had was, that at the end of each turn, instead of discarding your entire hand, you would be allowed to select one card to hold in your hand. It would add a lot of complexity to each turn, and it would allow you to plan ahead for future turns.

I do realize that this would probably mess with the math of drawing through the deck, since if you hold a card you would only draw 4 new cards instead of 5, but I think this works perfectly as a way to balance holding a card. Since you would not be forced to hold a card, it would sometimes be correct not to hold a card to see an additional card if you are looking for a specific type of card.

 

If anyone has any opinions on this please let me know. I think this would be a great way to make the game a bit more interesting and tactical.

 

 

EldrosKandar

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It might be interesting as a spell, but I don't think it is a good idea to make a general mechanic. If one follows what has already been drawn and what was leveled up, there is a way to plan ahead of time.

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Beelzebozo

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3:26 pm
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I also like it as a spell (somewhat like the Nethersnare promo construct in Ascension) but not as a general mechanic.

Racecar0
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I always thought of something like this as an Alloyin structure that lets you store a card underneath it.  The card would have an activated ability to either discard the card under it and place a new one there or to allow you to cast the card as one of your actions for the turn.  Maybe at later levels, it would allow you to cast the card for free.  That's how I saw this working, anyway.

EDIT: To expound on this, it would look like:

Quartermaster (or some such awesomer name)
Alloyin Structure
Level 1: Activate-Place a card from your hand underneath Quartermaster.  Activate-Play the card underneath Quartermaster as if it were played from your hand.  This counts as one of your actions for the turn.
Level 2: Activate-Place a card from your hand underneath Quartermaster or replace the card underneath Quartermaster with a card from your hand.  Activate-Play the card underneath Quartermaster as if it were played from your hand.  This counts as one of your actions for the turn.
Level 3: Activate-Place a card from your hand underneath Quartermaster or replace the card underneath Quartermaster with a card from your hand.  Activate-Play the card underneath Quartermaster as if it were played from your hand.  This does not count as one of your actions for the turn.


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Beelzebozo

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3:31 pm
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Racecar0 said

I always thought of something like this as an Alloyin structure that lets you store a card underneath it.  The card would have an activated ability to either discard the card under it and place a new one there or to allow you to cast the card as one of your actions for the turn.  Maybe at later levels, it would allow you to cast the card for free.  That's how I saw this working, anyway.

Brilliant. I completely support this exact card design. I hope SBE are reading some of this stuff. Free gold.

EldrosKandar

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Fire Sauce said
Brilliant. I completely support this exact card design. I hope SBE are reading some of this stuff. Free gold.

Maybe they can't, the same as Maro and other WotC employees can't look at Magic card solicitation for some kind of legal reason. Anyway I love the idea of a structure, it is more adapted for this kind of mechanic as a spell.

Racecar0 said
[...]
Quartermaster (or some such awesomer name)
Alloyin Structure
Level 1: Activate-Place a card from your hand underneath Quartermaster.  Activate-Play the card underneath Quartermaster as if it were played from your hand.  This counts as one of your actions for the turn.
[...]

The first activation should say "Activate-Place a card from your hand underneath Quartermaster, if there isn't already one.". Would prevent accumulating the cards under the structure.

You can call me Eldros. Feel free to send me untimed challenge at EldrosKandar for pseudo phantom draft. (List of test drafters)
----- 
The Soul Harvest draft deck is ready, you can see the deck I drafted. Try to guess which record I'll have in What's the pick? (Last update - 2014-03-28)
----- 
PTKTempo is the winner of the Asynchronous Initiative, the first asynchronous tournament, which was hosted by Evolution888 and yours truly! Stay tuned for more asynchronous action.
----- 
There was once a dream... Maybe it will be revived? See Alternative League (article by mnmike2002).

Racecar0
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3:39 pm
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Good point.  I'll make that adjustment before I post it to the card suggestions thread.

EDIT: On card solicitation: I know companies that use people's ideas.  L5R has a great little boilerplate that they require before any card submissions so they can use those ideas.  People have seen their cards made that way.


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Noetherian
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4:06 pm
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I agree that this is a very interesting mechanic. In particular, I could easily imagine a creature that read "When THIS comes into play, put a card from your hand on top of your deck". Similarly, a structure card could be interesting that gave you the ability (once per turn, while the structure was in play) to put a card from your hand on top of your deck.

As EldrosKandar said, I think that this is not needed as a core mechanic. Also, with regards to planning ahead, keep in mind that the demo decks have only one or two copies of many cards. This makes it harder to plan ahead because you can't count on drawing a card between reshuffles if you only have one copy of it. 

Finally, this seems like the type of mechanic that could be a fun variant to add at some point in the single-player campaign. (I think there is the opportunity to create a lot of fun single-player matches where the player is given the ability to "break the rules" in some way … like saving a card from one turn to the next)

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Racecar0
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4:20 pm
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Interestingly, I think this could be an interesting expansion mechanic down the line.  Give it the keyword "Shift" or some such.  Have the definition be something like what Noetherian described:

Instead of playing this card to the field, you may place it on top of your deck.  This does not count as one of your actions for the turn.

Then you could place it on all sorts of cards.


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Daveuf

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4:36 pm
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Good point on the original post that suggests each turn is sometimes a brand new puzzle – Unlike MTG where you're holding a hand and can formulate a gameplan.   But the beauty of Solforge is the small deck sizes.  The real strategy and gameplan would probably be in building your deck.  If you only have 7-10 unique cards in your deck, you can be more certain as to what's coming and go in with a gameplan.

How big are the decks anyway?  30 cards?  Or less?

 

 

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30 card minimums is what we've heard.  Used to be 40, but dropping down to 30 really tightened gameplay up.

 


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artrexdenthur

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6:05 pm
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Racecar0 said

Interestingly, I think this could be an interesting expansion mechanic down the line.  Give it the keyword "Shift" or some such.  Have the definition be something like what Noetherian described:

Instead of playing this card to the field, you may place it on top of your deck.  This does not count as one of your actions for the turn.

Then you could place it on all sorts of cards.

This would be a really interesting mechanic… Obviously cards with really great other abilities (or really great stats) wouldn't have shift, and so then you would have to choose between having one more chance for a really good card or knowing that you will have a specific, more average card. Also, the Quartermaster looks like a fantastic way to make Alloyin even more fun :)

EldrosKandar

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Maybe could shift exchange the card with the top card of the deck. I can totally imagine this mechanics on card on specific situation like boosting or debuffing spell (which needs a creature) or structure removal. Of course they will be to a lower power level as cards without the mechanic.

You can call me Eldros. Feel free to send me untimed challenge at EldrosKandar for pseudo phantom draft. (List of test drafters)
----- 
The Soul Harvest draft deck is ready, you can see the deck I drafted. Try to guess which record I'll have in What's the pick? (Last update - 2014-03-28)
----- 
PTKTempo is the winner of the Asynchronous Initiative, the first asynchronous tournament, which was hosted by Evolution888 and yours truly! Stay tuned for more asynchronous action.
----- 
There was once a dream... Maybe it will be revived? See Alternative League (article by mnmike2002).

nli10

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6:22 am
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A card I envisaged has you placing one card on top of your deck as the next level version but costs two 'moves' to do so.

 

If there is no cost to place the card under the construct or to use it from under the construct then once you have the lvl 3 version in play you can play all 5 cards each turn and would probably win… :)

 

I need to play the game a bit to get a feel for the mechanics – I've not had much experience with it yet.

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Racecar0
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That's the great thing about Activated abilities; they're only usable once per turn. :)

 


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Xavon

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8:32 pm
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I don't think the basic rules should be tampered with.

And I don't think a card that lets you keep one card would be very useful.  After all, you could just play that card instead of saving it.  I suppose there could be instances were you know that a specific card would be stronger in the next round (like damage or health based on monster stats or counts).  But even in those cases you are probably better off playing that card now, and getting second effect in the next turn.

I do like the store a card and use later structure.

 

Or how about:

 

Nature's Path

Uterra Spell

Level 1: Select two cards in your hand.  These cards are not discarded at the end of your turn.  Only draw three cards at the start of your next turn.

Level 2: Look at the top five cards of your opponent's deck.  Then select one card in your hand.  This card is not discarded at the end of your turn.  Only draw four cards at the start of your next turn.

Level 3: Use the Level 2 effect OR: Select three cards in your hand.  These cards are not discarded at the end of your turn.  You do not draw any cards at the start of your next turn, but may play up to three cards.

LordMagnus

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9:11 pm
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Xavon said
After all, you could just play that card instead of saving it.

You've never drawn a Cull 2 on turn 5 going first, have you?  :P

But seriously, I do agree that the basic rules should be kept as they are.  Though a card with a mechanic of keeping a card could have some pretty good synergies with cards that have a high variance.

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Jeremy

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3:15 pm
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I thought of this idea too, and while I understand that some folks wouldn't like it, I think it would be great to make it a customizable feature in the game.  You could put it in a "game settings" area along with things like starting life (where you could set the starting life total of each player too).  These settings would be obvious by iconography next to a list of available games to join (if there ends up being a "lobby" that lists them).  Options for the "Save One Card" settign could be "Yes", "No", or "Don't Care" (which would allow you to see/join either type of game).

Gabo

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I've really enjoyed the whole design of Solforge but one of the things that I always felt lacking was something like the feature suggested here. Basically I wonder why (please someone explain) you can't just decide how many cards to discard and how many to keep.

This being a digital only game, it can deal with this kind of thing by automatically keeping track and indicating of how many cards you have discarded and how long till you reshuffle so keeping track shouldn't be an issue. Allowing players to keep cards in their hands adds a new choice: you can discard your whole hand and move as fast as possible towards the next level (reshuffle) or you can keep known pieces that you know you need with the disadvantage of slowing down your development.

I don't think it makes the game more complex in terms of rules because its a natural way to expect the game to go (discard as many cards as you want, draw till you have 5) yet it adds deepness to the game. Can someone explain why it was designed the way it currently plays and what advantages (more fun? simpler? deeper strategy?) it has?

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Gabo said
I've really enjoyed the whole design of Solforge but one of the things that I always felt lacking was something like the feature suggested here. Basically I wonder why (please someone explain) you can't just decide how many cards to discard and how many to keep.

This being a digital only game, it can deal with this kind of thing by automatically keeping track and indicating of how many cards you have discarded and how long till you reshuffle so keeping track shouldn't be an issue. Allowing players to keep cards in their hands adds a new choice: you can discard your whole hand and move as fast as possible towards the next level (reshuffle) or you can keep known pieces that you know you need with the disadvantage of slowing down your development.

I don't think it makes the game more complex in terms of rules because its a natural way to expect the game to go (discard as many cards as you want, draw till you have 5) yet it adds deepness to the game. Can someone explain why it was designed the way it currently plays and what advantages (more fun? simpler? deeper strategy?) it has?

So, I certainly agree that the option to save cards would be easy to incorporate into the game/user-interface.

However, I don't understand why the option to save several cards each turn would add depth/deepness to the game. Brian Kibler (one of the SolForge designers) had a wonderful discussion of adding more options for the player doesn't always add depth to the gameplay. (The question he answers doesn't specifically have to do with saving cards in your hand, but I think his point still applies.)

Kibler's response was in this video at 1:36:00  (That is, one hour and 36 minutes into the stream.)

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